Evidence at last! (Intestinal immunity problem)

potty_mouth · Post by **potty_mouth** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 1:59 pm

Hi everyone, sorry i have not posted for a long time. I have been waiting for something concrete to post about... and finally I think I am onto something.
In a previous post I had suggested that sufferers in the US should take a particular test that is unavailable in most countries.
http://biohealthlab.com/test-menu/immun ... est-304-2/
This suggestion was based upon some people finding cures in gluten-free and other diets, but also that many of us suffer intestinal and/or allergic symptoms.
I recently went to the States for personal reasons so decided to take my own advice and had the test. The results came back as "severe loss of intestinal immune tolerance to all antigens present on a daily basis. This severe loss of immune tolerance may result in gut barrier dysfunction or leaky gut syndrome."

Above is my own result, with personal details removed.
I think it is a particularly interesting line of enquiry because it is a new test, which proves that what gets into our intestines (including the food we eat) does have an effect on our saliva - and not only a local effect, but also a blood-mediated immunological effect. These extra secretions in our mouths could themselves be enough to thicken our saliva and cause tongue coating... or even attack the healthy linings of our mouths or the beneficial bacteria that normally reside there.
So I am not really sure where this will lead. I am not even sure if this is the cause or if it is a symptom of something else, but I'm certain that it is something that most people don't have and so is part of the problem.
Here is a list of my symptoms which could in some way be related to this finding.
Oral BB
Nasal BB
Smelly skin around nose and mouth
Very thick saliva / mucus
Tongue coating
Slow intestinsal motility / constipation / occasional haemorrhoids
Mild diverticulitis
Acid reflux / ulcer
Body odour (although I am never sure if it is just bad BB).
My next step is to see an immunologist this Friday and to get tested for Cortisol levels (adrenal stress indicator). Any thoughts welcome from everyone.
Cheers
PM
[/img][/url]

seanlee1980 · Post by **seanlee1980** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 4:33 pm

Hi, thanks for posting this. This is very interesting. Ive had tests done for low igA count and I do have low igA, but Ive never heard if this. Did you see a gastroenterologist? I suspect we both have the same issue. Im also looking into gastroparesis. Anyhow, I do think its digestion related. Serotonin supplements helped me temproraily. I read its supposed to stimulate the digestive system but again it helped temrorarily and is no longer effective. A good diet for me has been the most effective of course but I am unsure really what kind of diet is the best for us. I am very curious what your doctor is going to tell you. Thanks again.

DanielPine · Post by **DanielPine** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:01 pm

Finally another Australian on this site, how would you suggest you fix your problem?

Aussie Aussie Aussie

potty_mouth · Post by **potty_mouth** » Wed Oct 10, 2012 11:53 am

Hi, first of all I didn't really make it clear that I have had numerous test for food sensitivities and other allergies in the past and nothing showed up, but still I knew deep down that there was something not quite right. Normal allergy tests are done looking for IgE which is a type of antibody involved in immediate reactions to food and other stimuli. I do not seem to have any abnormal IgE response and so food allergies have always been dismissed. This is particularly a problem when food allergy screens are suggested by, and interpreted by, health professionals such as naturopaths and GPs, who don't really know the science behind intestinal immunity, some of which is very new.
Some tests are now looking for IgG response which is a delayed and more subtle immune response than IgE but IgG does not always get activated in every situation:
"Therefore, if antigens are injected into the submucosal tissues, they are likely to induce serum IgG antibodies as well as secretory IgA antibodies in saliva. However, if it is applied topically to the skin or to the intraepithelial tissue, the resultant main product is only secretory IgA, which is detected in saliva"
quoted from this brilliant article:
http://intestinalbarriertest.com/pdf/Wh ... ojdani.pdf
So my test results shown above are only showing up because of testing for salivary IgA and IgM. Sorry to bombard with science, but I really believe there are lots of people out there who are having immune responses despite having tested negative for IgE (or IgG) in the past.

halitosisux · Post by **halitosisux** » Wed Oct 10, 2012 6:53 pm

Potty mouth, that's really interesting. I hope you manage to find out whether your BB connects to this in some way and that eventually you'll be able to discover the exact pathway by which this leads to your BB, and be able to do something about it.

I can't remember, but are you the person who works with gas spectrometers? If you are, have you analysed your own breath gases? If so, does it connect in any way to this test you've had done?

I suffer (or have suffered at times throughout my life) with many of the ailments you've described above.

One of the main ailments I suffer with is asthma. I remember seeing a documentary once, where they were trying to figure out the cause of asthma. It lead them to some remote island somewhere, where nobody (or it may have been everybody) suffers with asthma. They discovered that it was something to do with either the presense or the absense of certain intestinal parasites. It related in some way to the immune reaction in the intestine.

My point is, that if something like this can so significantly affect the immune system enough to cause asthma, then surely it can also potentially affect it enough to cause BB - or at least increase or decrease a person's susceptiblity to BB.

Good luck with the rest of your tests.

meowkity1 · Post by **meowkity1** » Wed Oct 10, 2012 11:11 pm

What are they doing for you to treat all of these high levels that they found

potty_mouth · Post by **potty_mouth** » Thu Oct 11, 2012 2:35 am

DanielPine wrote:Finally another Australian on this site, how would you suggest you fix your problem?

Aussie Aussie Aussie

Thanks Daniel. I am a "Pom" by birth but become a fully fledged Aussie on Australia Day! What city do you live in? Maybe we could organise a meetup? I'm supposed to be helping co-ordinate a breath test in Australia for Mebo too. But I haven't heard back about that yet.

To answer your question, I am going to see a GI specialist and an immunologist tomorrow. I hope that at least the immunologist will know about this type of test and its significance.
Biohealth's own site suggests following up with a Cortisol check, since adrenal stress and intestinal issues are closely linked apparently. I will certainly request this and any further immunological test that I can get.

Halitosisux,
yes it is me who works in gas chromatography, among other things. The problem with sulphur detection is it requires a particular type of detector which not many of my customers have. Even then I would need to calibrate the system with known standard gases so that I knew what peaks were what. Nobody I know is running analysis of dimethyl sulphide, methyl mercaptan, etc so I can't do a self-test... though I would love to.

Meowkity,
I'm not sure what they will suggest as treatment, but I am going to go on a leafy greens-only diet, to try to get my intestinal flora back to something like that of pre-historic man. There is some evidence that suggests you can heal intestinal issues (including immunity issues), by restoring beneficial bacteria because of the co-factors they release. I will post some links on this soon.

stevo96 · Post by **stevo96** » Thu Oct 11, 2012 5:42 am

I'm in brissy too! If you wanted to actually test your breath on a Oral Gas Chromo machine a dentist has one on the sunshine coast.... I know, I've been.

rikki · Post by **rikki** » Thu Oct 11, 2012 12:14 pm

Thank you potty_mouth for posting this information. I always knew that I had some sort of intestinal disorder so this makes so much sense and I suspect that many people on this forum have this same issue. I have recently been looking into a prescription steroid called Prednisone which is said to treat many different conditions such as allergic disorders and ulcerative colitis. A co-worker of mine took Prednisone for Ulcerative colitis and she described it as a steroid which you take over the course of 2-3 months and it strengthens and rebuilds intestinal lining. I am however uneasy to try this without a doctor’s recommendation since it can have many side effects.
By the way potty_mouth, how old were you when your bb began and, did BioHealth say that the Intestinal immune disorder could have been caused by a type of bacteria or parasite?
Please keep us updated on how your appointments with the GI specialist and Immunologist go and thanks for your post once again.