please, i need some ideas

halitosisux · Post by **halitosisux** » Tue Oct 20, 2009 3:49 pm

Hi danger, I dont know how I didnt see your question yesterday, so let me explain what i feel about this...

I used to scrape my tongue in the mornings with a scraper and a bit of toothpaste and I also once tried retardex and some other liquid version of chlorine dioxide but the tongue reacts to any such damaging treatment by growing a thicker coating - yes the coating of the tongue is not just about bacteria and fungus although these do play a overall role. The tongue papillae evolved on our tongues to provide a habitat for bacteria to thrive there (wont go into why). Cells continually shed away from the ends of these papillae a bit like nails on the end of a finger. Apart from bacterial purposes this coating also assists the tastebuds to taste by soaking up the food we're eating by remaining moist, that's why bad tastes from BB or even from eating can linger because this coating is so absorbant.

So.. when i realised that any measures I took on my tongue were futile for me, I stopped bothering. My tongue smelled no matter what I did with it. Just before I had my tooth removed I tried to keep the tooth clean by swooshing my wisdom tooth area with saliva using the tip of my tongue and my mouth felt like it was sustaining the best freshness it ever had before. My tongue was hardly smelling at all and I RAN to the dentist to ask to have it removed - and as soon as it was removed my tongue stopped smelling. I spent years convinced that something else must be causing my tooth to smell and that was subsequently causing whatever problem with my gum/tooth to smell - since this is precisely what I believe was happening with my tonsils - but how WRONG I was regarding my tooth because having it removed identified the root cause of the odour.

Danger, you have to understand that the bacteria in my mouth was not crappy bacteria, it was because the tooth/gum situation inside my mouth had formed a pocket which was anaerobic. Anaerobic bacteria were able to thrive inside there, discharging foul chemicals into my mouth (and onto my tongue where they became even more concentrated). Normally saliva flow is able to maintain a situation inside the mouth that prevents anaerobic overactivity, but even during sleep for most people, this is prevented from happening - and proof that EVERYONE has the bacteria inside their mouth which is capable of causing BB under the right conditions.

danger · Post by **danger** » Tue Oct 20, 2009 4:01 pm

halitosisux wrote:Hi danger, I dont know how I didnt see your question yesterday, so let me explain what i feel about this...

I used to scrape my tongue in the mornings with a scraper and a bit of toothpaste and I also once tried retardex and some other liquid version of chlorine dioxide but the tongue reacts to any such damaging treatment by growing a thicker coating - yes the coating of the tongue is not just about bacteria and fungus although these do play a overall role. The tongue papillae evolved on our tongues to provide a habitat for bacteria to thrive there (wont go into why). Cells continually shed away from the ends of these papillae a bit like nails on the end of a finger. Apart from bacterial purposes this coating also assists the tastebuds to taste by soaking up the food we're eating by remaining moist, that's why bad tastes from BB or even from eating can linger because this coating is so absorbant.

So.. when i realised that any measures I took on my tongue were futile for me, I stopped bothering. My tongue smelled no matter what I did with it. Just before I had my tooth removed I tried to keep the tooth clean by swooshing my wisdom tooth area with saliva using the tip of my tongue and my mouth felt like it was sustaining the best freshness it ever had before. My tongue was hardly smelling at all and I RAN to the dentist to ask to have it removed - and as soon as it was removed my tongue stopped smelling. I spent years convinced that something else must be causing my tooth to smell and that was subsequently causing whatever problem with my gum/tooth to smell - since this is precisely what I believe was happening with my tonsils - but how WRONG I was regarding my tooth because having it removed identified the root cause of the odour.

Danger, you have to understand that the bacteria in my mouth was not crappy bacteria, it was because the tooth/gum situation inside my mouth had formed a pocket which was anaerobic. Anaerobic bacteria were able to thrive inside there, discharging foul chemicals into my mouth (and onto my tongue where they became even more concentrated). Normally saliva flow is able to maintain a situation inside the mouth that prevents anaerobic overactivity, but even during sleep for most people, this is prevented from happening - and proof that EVERYONE has the bacteria inside their mouth which is capable of causing BB under the right conditions.

thanks sux for taking the time for a proper explanation

my tongue at the moment stinks, i put my finger in the middle third of it and then smell my finger and it literally stinks of shit

i honestly cant imagine having a clean tongue now that doesnt stink

for the last year or so when watching tv i have tried to examine people's tongues(insane i know) and when i notice one's tongue is a bit white i assumed they must have bad breath. i know that is not the case now

i remember showing my dentist my tongue in march cuz i was worried about it and he said it looked normal. he showed me his and his had a similar coating to mine. i could not understand how he would not have bad breath either

sux, could you used to be able to smell your breath when cupping your hands over your mouth? because i can

i dont know why people say you cant smell your own breath. that is rubbish

meowkity1 · Post by **meowkity1** » Tue Oct 20, 2009 5:33 pm

I just want to say my tongue used to smell and taste like pure poop and shit, and then I was put on amoxclav, and it took away these smells but i still just had a hot mouth,
Some people mentioned my symptoms sounded like sinus infection, so I went to the docs and just told them I had sinus infection symptoms and they gave it to me. Since then I have not tasted poop or rotten egg at all.
After you get that tooth pulled you may want to try it, although its obviouse its that wisdom tooth hopefuly

meowkity1 · Post by **meowkity1** » Tue Oct 20, 2009 5:37 pm

danger werent yu supposed to go to the dentist today, to see about getting it pulled. What happened?

danger · Post by **danger** » Tue Oct 20, 2009 6:14 pm

kitty, i have a dentist appointment tomorrow where i am going to request to get both my lower wisdom teeth removed

i think my right lower one is the main one where the smell is coming from but my left one is the one that is impacted worse(strange eh?)

so, i am going to tell him that both are causing me alot of physical pain all the time so he will have to agree to get them out

halitosisux · Post by **halitosisux** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 10:29 am

Danger, I could clearly smell SHIT with the standard hand cupping method whenever my breath was allowed to get bad.. this would go for a while after brushing/rinsing/eating etc.

I could also smell shite by standing in the corner of a neutral smelling room, breathe out slowly and calmly and then quickly move head forward and breathe in sharply. Takes practice.

Another thing i'd do is cup one hand over my nose and hold my tongue out underneith the cupped hand and clearly smell my tongue. If u keep doing that a few times and let the tongue dry out you can really smell it strongly.

I can still smell something when i do that last one, when its allowed to dry out, but NOTHING like as bad as before.

When people say u cant smell you own breath, I think what they really mean to say is that you cant RELIABLY smell your own breath. This is fact because I can still smell a small amount of odour on my tongue, but had I not known the difference that a small amount of odour and a LOT of odour makes the difference between someone having BB and someone not having BB, I would have just assumed I MUST have BB.

Self diagnosis of BB is risky because our senses can be fooled in so many different ways - the only way to know for sure is through trusted feedback.

danger · Post by **danger** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:38 pm

ok, so i went to the dentists earlier

i explained to him i still had a bad taste and also exagerrated that i had physical pain on both lower wisdom teeth

after him giving all my teeth a look at, i told him i want my 2 lower wisdom teeth extracted because i thought he might have been trying to put me off the idea

anyway, he agreed that for me to have my 2 lower wisdom teeth extracted, it would be better and easier to do if i got my upper wisdom teeth out as well first because they could have been contributing to the problem somehow( i was just relieved that he said i could have them out so i was not going to argue, even though it might just have been excuse to get more money out of me. i would like all my wisdom teeth out anyway)

he said he could take the 2 upper wisdom teeth out and also my right lower wisdom out, but my left lower was so impacted i would have to go to hospital for that

so, as it stands now, i am getting one of my upper wisdom teeth out in about 12 days and the other upper one out a few days later(£65 each)

he then said after that if i still have not got an appointment booked with the hospital, he would agree to take out my right lower wisdom out himself(i think it was about £130), otherwise i would just get both my lower wisdoms out at the same time at the hospital.

for the time being, he has given me a week's worth of metro, which he said would help with the bad taste in my mouth

sux, im sure i read that you took metro when you had bad breath. did it get rid of your breath and bad taste while you were on it? what was it like compared to now? was it similar in making your mouth fresh?

the thing is i have a family thing next week and it would be good to take for the next week if it gets rid of my breath and taste temporarily at least

so, other than the time that i will be taking metro maybe, my breath will and taste in my mouth will stink until i at least get one of my lower wisdom teeth out( hopefully it wont be too long) but at least i have hope now

meowkity1 · Post by **meowkity1** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:47 pm

This is just my opinion but I think yo should wait to take metro until you get teeth pulled. Because all the stinky puss will still make your mouth bad.
Pull the tooth and then work on the bacteria
Just my opinion though
I am glad he agreed

danger · Post by **danger** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:17 pm

meowkity1 wrote:This is just my opinion but I think yo should wait to take metro until you get teeth pulled. Because all the stinky puss will still make your mouth bad.
Pull the tooth and then work on the bacteria
Just my opinion though
I am glad he agreed

kitty, thanks for your feedback and i do understand your point

maybe, i will be given more metro or something similar after my teeth have come out?

and i just remembered, i still have the prescription that my doctor gave me for metro when i went to see him a few months back,which i have never used. i wonder if i could still use that

does anybody know how long after you are giving a prescription can you still get it?

but the next week i will be around people,family etc, so if the metro can help me in that time i wouldnt like to take it

halitosisux · Post by **halitosisux** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 3:09 pm

hey danger, well done.
If your upper wisdoms arent really suspected as a cause of your BB, why dont u have those done in hospital for free when u have the badly impacted lower tooth out - but pay your dentist to take out the one u do suspect which he said he can take out for you.

Also dont risk needlessly messing with antibiotics - you might need metro for something else one day and find your bacteria are immune to it. Happens a lot with helicobacter therapy where people have used metro for other things and then it cant be used to treat helicobacter because they've developed resistance to it. Metro is one of the types of antibiotics that easily becomes ineffective because of resistance. I understand your temptation, but its not worth it for the reasons you mentioned.

halitosisux · Post by **halitosisux** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 3:18 pm

Forgot to say.. that when I last used metro (as part of triple therapy for helicobacter) I was still completely unaware of my wisdom tooth problem. But when I was on this it made my mouth completely clean - no tongue odour - but within a few days, even whilst still on it, I started to develop different odours and tastes - just as strong, but totally different - I think this was species of bacteria taking over which are unaffected by the metro, including possibly fungus - but within a few days of stopping the metro, everything reverted back to how it was before.
Metronidazole, like a lot of antibiotics, is secreted in the saliva - so it was like a constant mouthwash system, I think.

danger · Post by **danger** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 3:28 pm

halitosisux wrote:hey danger, well done.
If your upper wisdoms arent really suspected as a cause of your BB, why dont u have those done in hospital for free when u have the badly impacted lower tooth out - but pay your dentist to take out the one u do suspect which he said he can take out for you.

Also dont risk needlessly messing with antibiotics - you might need metro for something else one day and find your bacteria are immune to it. Happens a lot with helicobacter therapy where people have used metro for other things and then it cant be used to treat helicobacter because they've developed resistance to it. Metro is one of the types of antibiotics that easily becomes ineffective because of resistance. I understand your temptation, but its not worth it for the reasons you mentioned.

sux, you actually make a good point on the extractions. i didnt really think of that
my dentist actually showed me my scan and did mention that my upper wisdom teeth were pulling down on the gum or something and did seem to think that they should come out as well(i was so relieved that something was going to get done i was not thinking straight)
but as i have said, i am sure it is my lower right wisdom tooth that is causing the worst of my problem. i really wished now i suggested what you did
do you think i should go and see him tomorrow? the only thing now is that i might have to pay again for another check up to talk it over with him.
and if there is a main reason why the upper ones have to come out first then it might delay it all again
what do you think i should do? i doubt if i go in tomorrow he will be free to talk to me. or could i just ask him to take the lower one out when i go for my supposed upper wisdom extraction? or cant they just change their preparations on the day?

and about the metro. so you would not even recommend me taking the metro that my dentist has prescribed for a week?

danger · Post by **danger** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 3:34 pm

halitosisux wrote:Forgot to say.. that when I last used metro (as part of triple therapy for helicobacter) I was still completely unaware of my wisdom tooth problem. But when I was on this it made my mouth completely clean - no tongue odour - but within a few days, even whilst still on it, I started to develop different odours and tastes - just as strong, but totally different - I think this was species of bacteria taking over which are unaffected by the metro, including possibly fungus - but within a few days of stopping the metro, everything reverted back to how it was before.
Metronidazole, like a lot of antibiotics, is secreted in the saliva - so it was like a constant mouthwash system, I think.

just seen this

if it can make my mouth clean just for the week i am on it and then it returns to how it is now i would take that. just so i could get through the next week where i will have to mingle with family etc

what i am worried about though is after i come off it is the taste and breath comes back worse(which my doctor said might happen)

if i didnt have a family gathering next week i would definitely just leave it and lay low until my wisdom teeth are all out and pray that will finally solve it. now i am in two minds whether it is worth the risk

halitosisux · Post by **halitosisux** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 2:42 pm

danger, all your questions have already been answered really. Nothing difficult about any of it.

danger · Post by **danger** » Thu Oct 22, 2009 5:57 pm

sux, sorry if it seemed that i was repeating my questions to you

anyway, i have decided i wont bother to take any metro

and i went to the dentist today about getting my right lower wisdom tooth out first. my dentist was not there but i explained the situation to the people on reception(one of the woman was in there yesterday so i think understood what i was talking about) and they said that they would make a note about my request to my dentist.

so hopefully i will be getting my lower right one out first. i just have a feeling my dentist will be awkward about it. i am beginning to think he does not feel comfortable taking it out himself so is just trying to delay it for the hospital

sux, sorry if you have already mentioned this but did you get the one causing you the problem in a hospital or by your normal dentist?